What is Racism?
Sep 22nd, 2008, in Asides, by PatungI am getting tired of discussions constantly drifting into the areas we see below, cut from the effeminate men post.
I titled this post “What is Racism?” because, hmm, some stereotypes about different peoples are actually true, and in scientific terms a stereotype must be true, or else it isn’t a stereotype…But I don’t know if there is some formula that determines at what point the exceptions to the rule become so numerous that the stereotype breaks down and has to be abandoned.
I generally don’t like accusations of “racist” and “racism” being thrown around, they are substitutes for thought and argument, or they attempt to stop thought and argument, but I don’t think I’m alone in getting weary at some people constantly carping about Chinese or Anglos, or whoever…
This is the original bit by Purba Negoro which sparked the following off:
Indosiar is also Chinese owned. UNsurpisingly its’ content is facile, derivative, cheap and trite- outirght plagiarisms of better Western models and the lowest possible investment for highest possible profit-wan, aiya- exemplify fondly held Chinese values- the love of tinsel and trinkets.
Metro TV is owned by Pak Paulo. The quality of the station is far superior than profit-at-any-cost typical Chinese penny-dreadfuls. Just like their Tempo and Jakarta Post- self-serving or self-aggrandising pulp fictions.
306 Comments on “What is Racism?”
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dragonwall says:
You said
There is no Beck’s beer brewery in Indonesia.
Heineken has full control over all breweries- including Anker and Bintang.This show how ignorant you are or pretending to be too smart. When I first met Eddy Tansil the beer started with Beck’s Beer (Cap Kunci) at his office in Jln Samanudhi.
Tansil brewery is in Putian, Fujian- hiding out with the other Indonesia Chinese white collar criminals- usually Fujian, Guangzhou or Shenzen
So how come you said he is in the US? You are damn right he is there because he is a Fuqing from the Fujian Province. Learn more about the Fujian Province before making any comments.
As to
You should have seen some of their faces when a big group of us pribumi are invited to Shenzen for golf and tourism paid by Chinese Government.
And as for
They turned as white as ghosts- very funny
You are referring to yourself or the Chinese Officials. Or you were trying to tell us that Eddy Tansil’s face turn white on seeing you guys?
That is why, people like you are what you admitted to be incorrigible treacherous ungrateful SOB that when you were given something free you are all back patting. When it comes to others, Oh the Chinese is this the Chinese is that.. and so on.
Since you said
Most Indonesian Chinese fraudsters flee to Singapore, Australia, Canada, US and then some eventually move to China- where it’s impossible to extract them
The Singapore Government signed an extradition treaty with Indonesia right! So why not exert whatever possible under the law to ahve them extradited. Why whin and sigh. What does that prove? Incompetency. Bring out whatever that is non fabricated and prove that they are guilty then you will have them back into Indonesia in ONE PIECE.
You said
Most have passed through the US- FBI not INS actually enforces the law. INS has its’ hands tied as Chinese and Mexican mafia smuggle in millions of cheap labourers and illegal immigrants- hene the US having major problems with immigration.
Oh yeah is that right. One Federal Level all of them falls belwo the DOJ. Then come Homeland Security which overseas all of those law enforcement department. Immigration department also falls under them but they have the jurisdiction over other law enforcement agency by requesting them to assist. And any person seeking protection from the American government will have to go through the EOIR.
With this it already shows how ignorant you are in trying to preach US Law?So by saying this
No one has the right to claim another man’s job in another land- precisely what the Chinese and Indians are very guilty of.
You mean the Indian and Chinese are stealing your jobs or the American’s? By ignoring the existence of self build business shows how poor the diligence in you.
Indians (India including Punjabi) and Chinese build business that always compliment the environment and society here in US.
The one thing American law they make sure that there are no two similar businesses in one complex and that is protection for their own people. And due to your failure to observe that these existence shows the high potential in the Chinese who knows how to pick and choose location to enhance their existence.Gullible people like you will say this
If Chinese and Indians actually worked for award wages (rather than undercut locals), were legitimate migrants rather than economically motivated illegals and actaully empoloyed locals (rather than other illegals on slave-labour wages) it would be a very different story. But I’m sure you as a Chinese resto owner- paying your illegal immigrant dishwasher $2 an hour and chef $3 an hour- wages held low by extortion via threat of deportation or suspension of fradulent migrant sponsorship papers- (the usual Hokkien tricks) you would be in an expert position to tell us all about that.
Try showing me one instance that the Chinese and Indians were paid 2 or 3 $ per hour?
Sheer conjecture. Workers are paid between 6.75 to 15 an hour depending on their vocations. The average they get is between 70 to 120$ per day. Waiter and waitress earns between 1800 to 3500$ per month. So if you do not know please shut your gap.The real Indonesian diaspora is tiny.
But were considered to be the worst workers of all. Pointing fingers, snitch for the Feds and etc causing so much hardship your own fellow Indonesians. All these are the pris who were paid between 500 for providing information to the feds in Philadelphia. The Chinese do not do that.
The Chinese Indonesian diaspora is much larger than the pribumi one. Why is that? Snakeheads?
You mean there is Indonesian snakeheads? Ahh..waduh.. Now I know.. I think you were referring to people like the Din guy and your compatriot that send TKI and TKW by the plane load to Middle East, Taiwan, HK and Singapore?
So whose diaspora is that? Who are the snakeheads. Just because you haerd some CNN stories reporting of human trafficking from China you linked them to the Indonesian Chinese. That really reflects on the integrity of a person which I think you didn’t have at all.
Mind you one thing the Fujian pays between 75,000 and other Chinese nationals pays between 20,000 because they requested to be smuggled into the US or Canada. They asked for it. It cost that much to the Fuzhou and Fuqing is because they do not have the money at hand and will pay on instalments plus interest when they successfully arrived into the US. So can you figure out the difference between drug trafficking and human trafficking? Both are illegal activities but the letter were cause on compassionate ground. You think the snakeheads is willing t take any dick, tm and harry like you? Please don’t comment on something you don’t know.So is it
Wrong again cukong licik.
Keep working on your Singlish-English online translator though.- I think it’s marginally funnier this time- ever though of your own website?People like you reminds me of people whom you said “fan” “hua na” right, twist and turn, evading and elusive avoing question right to the point. So you mean you have a website?
As for his
since you offered me such interesting material on Tansil:
why not read all about your CHinese friends and illegal immigration racketeering- by Salim: Hokkien Chinese- will they ever learn to abide by the law?Do I have to read all those? or do I need to read those? You should read more of those to get yourself more educated on this topic.
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purba negoro says:
Dragonwall,
of course. Glodok gossip far more based on quantitative research, investigative journalism and fact than CNN, PBN etc…
and not sheer conjecture- well proven by innumerable FBI raids on Chinese businessesFujian centre of internal human savlery?
Thousands of Chinese from rural parts of the country try to enter Taiwan illegally every year, looking for work and better economic prospects.Most are smuggled by boat from Fujian Province and pay brokers between US$400 and US$1,500.
Statistics from the Ministry of the Interior show that Taiwanese police intercepted 8,164 illegal immigrants from 2001 to the end of last year.
Of the 5,097 women arrested, 44 percent were engaged in prostitution
Sara is the only child of a rural family in Fujian. Her parents put all their hope on her, hoping that she will study as only education can change one’s fate. Three years ago, Sara’s friend told her she could pay $20,000 to be smuggled to the US.
Sara says her friend told her that a job with at least $3,000 in monthly salary would be arranged for her once she had arrived the United States. The salary sounded attractive because it is equivalent to two or three years’ salary in China. Sara thought even if she worked without legal status, she would only have to endure it for a year before she would have enough to pay back the debt. A year later, she would only be 15, and then she could enroll in an American school.
At 14, she boarded a boat and headed to The United States. After four months of traveling, she was smuggled into New York City. Her smuggler, “Snakehead,” sold her to another group which kept her passport, locked her in a basement, beat her and told her to cough up more money. They told her she had to pay $80,000.
Sara says, “At that time I cried, why does $20,000 become $80,000?” They told her that if she did not produce the money she would be beaten to death. She was held at gunpoint and one of the men said, “If you don’t have the money, we’ll gang-rape you.” She cried. Those men stripped her and beat her. They called her parents, threatening to kill her if they didn’t pay the $80,000. Sara’s parents agreed and told her over the phone, “Just pay them. You are already there, we cannot do anything.”
Sara thought of escaping, but the door was guarded by two gangsters and one of them had a gun. Few days later, Sara was made to work in a take-out restaurant, washing dishes, and delivering take-out. She worked 14 hours a day, six days a week, every month she would send money home to her parents to pay back her debt to the smuggler.
A NYPD Vice Enforcement Detective explains how the NYPD formed an Anti-human Trafficking Unit. Six police officers were trained to identify victims of human trafficking, in hoped of cracking organized crime rings through the victims.
The detective says police were targeting three main groups, including Asians, Latinos and Russians. They had learned that customers of human trafficking cases solicited primarily within their own ethnic groups. Chinese men frequent Chinese brothels, and so on. T
The Congress Report on Human Trafficking criticized China for not putting enough efforts into combating human trafficking, yet it praised China for aggressively investigating and prosecuting traffickers.
The report says China is the main source for people being smuggled. Men, women and children were forced to be illegal workers and prostitutes. Women were sold to Taiwan, Thailand, Malaysia and Japan as prostitutes.
Very different quality of reportage as opposed to your Glodok Bangkit.
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with this I summed you up that you are far less intelligent than others thought to be when you said
of course. Glodok gossip far more based on quantitative research, investigative journalism and fact than CNN, PBN etc…
and not sheer conjecture- well proven by innumerable FBI raids on Chinese businessesAs for this
Fujian centre of internal human savlery?
Let me understand the word slavery better. Can you elaborate? Then compare the difference between slavery, human trafficking and consensual decision.
Thousands of Chinese from rural parts of the country try to enter Taiwan illegally every year, looking for work and better economic prospects
Most are smuggled by boat from Fujian Province and pay brokers between US$400 and US$1,500.
Statistics from the Ministry of the Interior show that Taiwanese police intercepted 8,164 illegal immigrants from 2001 to the end of last year..Don’t the Indonesans into Malaysia and other parts of the world one way or another?
And
Of the 5,097 women arrested, 44 percent were engaged in prostitution
They deserve it because they wanted quick money. What about Dolly and other prostitute dens in Indonesia?
Nice interesting defractive stories on “SARA” but if they are caught being a prostitute they deserve it.
Until this very day I have never hear of anyone paying more than 70,000 USD from Fujian. Two year ago it was around 50 to 60,000. Max they pay is around 70
and as for your so called snakehead, it showed what you commented are from media coverage and not actual confrontations.
So I guess it would be a waste of time talking to people like you who knows nothing on this topics.And as for this
Very different quality of reportage as opposed to your Glodok Bangkit.You have proven again that you are no less someone with repitition and propaganda. An ultimate idiot moronis bigot who jest.
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Dragonwall,
how on earth would such a scrupulous honest businessmen such as yourself and other Chinese know about such horrible illegal activities dealing in human misery?Perhaps you can explain this apparent paradox. The hunger for profit above humanity.
And why the Fujian police and government are sheltering these human traffickers?
Especially since Chinese people, by your account, are above bribery?
As you are aware- Indonesian maids and guest workers or TKW are represented by majority Chinese agencies taking 60% and above cut of their wages.
But- this being the case- as you yourself mention- it is consensual- it is legal and it is with the written request and express Official authorisation of the host nation. and as you so correctly alluded to – all TKW VISA’s are legitimate and pre-approved.So why is the above paragraph not taken into consideration for Fujian human slave-traders?
Especially written Official consent?And how do you explain Dolly and Mickey Mouse club etc all being owned by ethnic Chinese- Anton Medan and other such nasty characters- like their PTA society- the Sembilan Naga- 9 Dragons?
Hai Lai?
Stadium?
Lion King?Please clarify this apparent paradox too.
Quoting your own substandard and barely coherent English is not a veyr strong argument.Try again- perhaps your fee-for-degree- was not worth the toilet-tissue it was printed on?
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And you were saying
how on earth would such a scrupulous honest businessmen such as yourself and other Chinese know about such horrible illegal activities dealing in human misery?
Didn’t you explaing that earlier and with that many links that you master by copy and pasting? I was never wrong sizing you up as a jester and how stupid you are becoming each day.
The hunger for profit above humanity.
Don’t you too? If you say no then it will surely display the hypocrisy in you.
And why the Fujian police and government are sheltering these human traffickers? Especially since Chinese people, by your account, are above bribery?
You should go ask the Chinese Government and demand them to give you the explanation on law enforcement and the bribery stuffs you so needed.
As you are aware-
No I am not, why should I?
Indonesian maids and guest workers or TKW are represented by majority Chinese agencies taking 60% and above cut of their wages.
Then who is behind them? When you write something don’t just bring up the clean part. Bring out all the dirty parts too like colloboration with Depnaker officials and who were behinds all those schemes. I am sure your complacency brought you up to be such an idiot that you choose to ignore what was behind the scenes. Mass manipulation by those people in Depnaker.
But- this being the case- as you yourself mention- it is consensual- it is legal and it is with the written request and express Official authorisation of the host nation. and as you so correctly alluded to – all TKW VISA’s are legitimate and pre-approved.
See how stupid of you again. You even said and agreed it is contractual, consensual and legal. So what is the difference? You can’t differentiate between right and wrong.
So why is the above paragraph not taken into consideration for Fujian human slave-traders? Especially written Official consent?
Here you said slave traders? So those Indonesians that contract to work oversees are slave traders? Now can you please define the word slave trade and contract workers?
When the TKI and TKW signed a contract and agreed to that it is their own problem altogether. The Government approves with conditon of pre-requisite. Once the pre-requisite is met then there is simply nothing to whin and sigh about like what you are doing!As to
And how do you explain Dolly and Mickey Mouse club etc all being owned by ethnic Chinese- Anton Medan and other such nasty characters- like their PTA society- the Sembilan Naga- 9 Dragons?
Hai Lai?
Stadium?
Lion King?
Please clarify this apparent paradox too.Don’t you think every one move they made, there is always someone behind them?
I was nearly mistaken that you were quoting the Wali Songo!And as for you
Quoting your own substandard and barely coherent English is not a veyr strong argument.
I already said hard word breaks no bone and more over we never used big words in court unless specifically defined for.
And as for
Try again- perhaps your fee-for-degree- was not worth the toilet-tissue it was printed on?
I think it is only available in Indonesia and that has been considered by the International community that they were not worth the toilet tissue it was printed on.
Can you go to court showing a piece of fee-for-degree? Even with what you get you still needs to prove yourself so is my English barely coherent for you to understand?
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Aluang Anak Bayang says:
@ dragonwall
You hinted that you are involved in court related matters. I doubt it very much. Your lack of English proficiency gave you away, and I would describe your ‘mastery’ of the English language at Form 5 level best, nothing beyond that. IM readers are not stupid. I am sure many of us have picked it up and Rob took you to task on that one. PN came up with facts and figures with links included. Your responses lacked punch, just insults and name callings. You are a self-declared advocate for Indon Chinese woes. I believe this position should be better served by Sylvester and Enigmatic who are way ahead of your singlish. English is not the first language for either you or PN, but you are simply not in his league. Any unbias reader can tell you that.
I am telling you this to save you from further embarrassment. Best guess is that you are a Singaporean migrant to the US, and running a laundrymat.
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You know one thing I guess as much that either one of you will appear sooner or later because when that arse is busy you are missing and vice versa. I am speculating perhaps you may be using several proxy and different names. But anyway who cares right. I mean really when he is around you are not or sometime placying a little sidekick. It is also the vice versa.
As to
You hinted that you are involved in court related matters. I doubt it very much. Your lack of English proficiency gave you away, and I would describe your ‘mastery’ of the English language at Form 5 level best, nothing beyond that. IM readers are not stupid.
Why not Elementary? perhaps. Or perhaps you are right, then the next thing is that you might want me to reveal the law firm I am with, right? It didn’t bother me a bit.
And with
I am sure many of us have picked it up and Rob took you to task on that one. PN came up with facts and figures with links included. Your responses lacked punch, just insults and name callings. You are a self-declared advocate for Indon Chinese woes. I believe this position should be better served by Sylvester and Enigmatic who are way ahead of your singlish. English is not the first language for either you or PN, but you are simply not in his league. Any unbias reader can tell you that.
It is alright with me, you are most welcome to get Rob to come back. Not a bit of a problem to me. So with links it will prove you to be a smarter person? Do I need to be a self declared advocate, for Indon Chinese woes, perhaps! But one thing for sure any insults against the Chinese or Indonesian Chinese you will find me there. Got that.
One thing is that most of you, and you can come all three of you, just JP one another started by making insults and name callings then say others name calling and insults.
In the very first place, unless being agitated I don’t think it is me that likes to start with that.
And whether singlish, english ot whatever you guys want to term that, it doesn’t bothers to me the least.
The main problem with you people are that you tend to distract, defract, and lean away
from the main frame then started questioning others when you were unable to come up with a proper answer to a question.Whether Sylvester or you or way ahead or back it doesn’t matter to me either. I am here to tick MF’s off. Whether a reader is bias or not, who cares sort of to say.
And I am also telling you this to save you from further embarrassment because when you guys can’t come up with an answer to the question, you will start to pick another subject and started throwing smoke screen. I think it is not hard to guess the motives behind all those is by making me feel agitated and emotional then start revealing all sort of things, right? Not me. Never.
And you said
Best guess is that you are a Singaporean migrant to the US, and running a laundrymat.
Ha.ha.ha. how pathetic of you. Right..right..why laundrymat, perhaps restaurant?
Or perhaps you are trying to fish information finding out who are those that we represent when they migrate to the US or running away from Indonesia.
Why bother yourself about who is more educated or less educated when you or him can’t answer a simple question you asked?
I haven’t even started yet. And let me tell you soemthing. You can throw me a stone and I will throw back a bigger one at you.
Anyway who are you to tell me that? Find me a lawyer that uses words, like you guys do, in court before you continue to comment any further.
One thing I think you should do is to continue lickspittle one another, JP one another then rub a young girl on you lap otherwise you might find yourself out of gas.
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Yes, we Indonesians are still working on how to beat the Chinese on their:
2000 characters and growing “simplified” language
blue-eared pigs
SARS
Avian influenza
Bubonic plague
Eggs sucked free of actual egg then filled with glycerin
Melanin baby formula
Lead covered children’s toys
Toxic waste villagers
Cancer hamlets
Lead paint
Sex-slavery
so many more to listWhat have we evaded?
Or is it your ahem “legal” mind is too linear and simplistic to follow superior Indonesian argument skills?Drag-queen:
If you’re a legal mind- which I very much doubt your are- you must be Legal Aid Defence lawyer for Malays, Indians, mainland Chinese and Indonesians.
With you as legal representative- the Crown couldn’t fail: everyone ould be getting death sentences passed on jay-walking or public sneezing.I have seen your Chinese encyclopedia listing your culture’s “achievements”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Song_Yingxing
Not impressive.
And you compare yourself to the Greeks and Romans?A very poor comparison. Why Chinese are too proud to admit their society was a relatively backward agrarian society like all other Asian nations except Japan?
Is it that the Japanese excel in everything the Chinese claim as theirs?Are you angry you’ve ben exposed yet again as a liar?
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Now one after the other starts appearing complimenting one another.
If you guys just recall I said several of you were writing with almost synchronous similarity and words.
If you recall that AAB admits that he has 7 connections.
Then I suppose he is using several proxy with different nick placing comments praising one another.
And the tell tale sign is that the very moment I made a comment AAB starts to reply LOL…blah blah..blah.
OK to the point
Yes, we Indonesians are still working on how to beat the Chinese on their:
2000 characters and growing “simplified” languageLike taking away the “A’s” for example or writing alphabets without a stroke perhaps?
And as to these
blue-eared pigs
SARS
Avian influenza
Bubonic plague
Eggs sucked free of actual egg then filled with glycerin
Melanin baby formula
Lead covered children’s toys
Toxic waste villagers
Cancer hamlets
Lead paint
Sex-slavery
so many more to listI think you should worked that out yourself. Reading from medias, copy and paste links and start making putdowns is not going to make you a better person in any discussion.
What have we evaded?
Or is it your ahem “legal” mind is too linear and simplistic to follow superior Indonesian argument skills?KISS MY ARSE. You don’t even come close.
Drag-queen:
If you’re a legal mind- which I very much doubt your are- you must be Legal Aid Defence lawyer for Malays, Indians, mainland Chinese and Indonesians.
With you as legal representative- the Crown couldn’t fail: everyone ould be getting death sentences passed on jay-walking or public sneezing.Isuppose. Who cares about your doubt! And you were saying What..What..Crown and what Death sentence? And “Legal Aid”? Learn more before you continue. when you understand more about the legal systems.
It’s more like the both of you are “Drag Queen” dragging, evading the answers to a question, distracting into another subject and fade away like wind and dust.Dummy like you and AAB can come up with words like “stupider” in english and yet consider others to be substandard with applauding hands awaiting due to inferiority complex.
I have seen your Chinese encyclopedia listing your culture’s “achievements”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Song_Yingxing
Not impressive.Everyone has their opinion of their own and it is your right to be or not to be impress and on similare ground
And you compare yourself to the Greeks and Romans?A very poor comparison. Why Chinese are too proud to admit their society was a relatively backward agrarian society like all other Asian nations except Japan?
Is it that the Japanese excel in everything the Chinese claim as theirs?You and AAB can continue lickspittle anyone you like and nothing will change the Chinese history. As far as the Greeks and Romans are concern you just make me laugh when you guys were prvailing with such hatred on Chinese and Christians and yet you would want to admit that they are far superior and of course they are comparing to people like you and AAB..Clutching your dictionary and having several connections so that the wikipedia comes in handy.
Are you angry you’ve ben exposed yet again as a liar?
I guess this is about the best words you use without a dictionary because you don’t seemed to have another words to replace them.
And like what AAB claims of his knowledge about me that I am elementary, then that shows that being ticked off by an elementary students ticking the much praised champion of know nothing talk all nonsense cowards and traitors.
KEEP GOING ON PATTING ONE ANOTHER ON THE BACK AND CALL IT YOUR DAY. Because I could only find people like you posting second hand news copy and paste but trying to understand the real world let alone discuss about human trafficking and slavery. You didn’t fit the picture. Simple answer to a simple question. When someone answer a question you tends to make it sound as though others has to be involved in order to make you a smarter person, right!
JUST COME BACK WITH ANTI CHINESE DISCRIMINATIONS AND HATRED AND I WILL COME SMACKING SHIT GUYS RIGHT IN THE FACE. Others seemed immaterial to me.
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Dragonwall waits patiently for a customer, sure enough, in one walks. After looking at the extensive menu full of Chinese “delicacies” such as tiger penis, shark fin, “dancing bear paw”, cat, tiger wine soup, snake gall soup, snake, dog, puppy dim sim, etc- the customer opts for safety and chooses the chicken.
“Haya, Mr Whiety. How comer you so hansum? Velly good choice meh”, and Dragonwall dashes off to the kitchen filled with the squeaks, shrieks and squawks of all manner of caged beasts.
10 minutes later, Dragonwall ruse out- a banquet platter served huge steaming delicious smelling fried chicken piece de resistance.
The customer tries some chicken, looks quizzical. Tries some more- and makes a very strange face.
Dragonwall furrows his brow in apprehension, worrying “What if whity noh lika mai chicky? Must then hava to giver the daughter or run away to Singapore again”….The customer, puts down his chopsticks and says, “This chicken is the most rubbery I have ever tasted- no one has ever come close to cooking such a rubbery chicken. It is really something else”
Man-in-Drag hugs the customer, lifting him off his feet, shakes the mans hand vigorously and backs away bowing “shie-shie-ing”- “Koh Dragwonall me so happy you luva the chicken. NO body eva tella me hioaw lubberly it taste till you!”
Buy Cambridge Press’ “English in Pictures for Children” Drag-n-wail.
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Nice try of distraction. That already shows that you only know of putdowns and insults. Nothing else. Can’t even imitate Singlish.. If that is so like what Achmad said..SHUT THE F*CK UP.
These are about the only thing you know knowing that he knows nothing more than a second hand news links.
But anyway I think you are most befitting of a writer of putdowns and the anti Chinese, anti White JP.
SO step aside and shut the f*ck up.. This is what I said.
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@ dragonwall
You simply can’t get it. Let me try put it in simple term.
Your grasp of English ain’t as good as PN. You have not what it takes to be a formidable opponent. Your poor responses shows that you are not lawyer material. Any unbiased spectator can tell you that you are taking more than a couple of killer blows on every single round. It is best left for Janma, Sylvester, Enigmatic or even Raden who are at least his nemeses. Rob tried to tell you that and you called him an anti-chinese bule. LOL
PN is another Javanese but that doesn’t mean I agree with him totally what was said. However you are an arrogant Cheenaman who by your own account had made millions with Javanese connections and is now bad mouthing us. When I said that your responses lacked punch, it meant that there were many missed opportunities to counter PN’s onslaught. Instead you resorted to un-lawyerlike childish insults typical of uneducated peasant. Your responses were non sequitur chinese whispered dungs. Instead of defending the Chinese, you are backing up PN’s claim of a stereotypical parasitic Cheeman. I sometimes wonder you may be a straw puppet he created to beat the hell out of Cheeman. I recalled a live debate incident I witnessed in Taiwan many years ago. 2 rival candidates were debating on some issue. When one was losing ground; instead of accepting defeat, she spat at the face of her opponent incessantly, grabbed hold of the microphone and declared herself the winner of the debate. You reminded of her.
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AAB…
Least we agree on something. PN is in front on the PN vs. Dragonwall flame war.
I guess I need to post more as it has been a while since you have given me a good trashing 😉
Although, I did notice that you still think I am the greater evil in comparison to Andy 😀
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Enigmatic says:
Dragonwall,
I can see who’s the better one at arguments. There’s a bigot, ok maybe more, but that’s ok. don’t try to outtalk, sorry, outtype them, because it’s a waste of time.
perhaps, this would better sum up what i have to say to you.
ren yi shi feng ping lang jing, tui yi bu hai kuo tian kong.i can’t be bothered to read the rantings of certain people in this forum. not because i’m evading it. but because, really, it’s better doing some other consturctive work instead of coming up with counterarguments.
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Right and is that what you think?
You simply can’t get it.
As to
Your grasp of English ain’t as good as PN. You have not what it takes to be a formidable opponent.
So what is a formidable opponent. We are here to discuss on racism. Not talking sh*t with you racist guys! So do I need to write in perfect english to drive the message to sh*t guys like you two? The answer is definitely no. I can simply write a sentence and go away!
Your poor responses shows that you are not lawyer material.
I may not be writing with perfect english and neither have I claimed that I am with. But if that is what you think, that is fine because I suppose these are about the most debatable thing you guys know of, right? Anyway as to whether I am of lawyer material ‘It is for me to know and for you to find out’ because I have not been deny of my results. It is just that simple. Or perhaps I need to clutch on to the dictionary or have 8 to 10 connections with referrence links and wikipedia ready to counter the two of you?
Any unbiased spectator can tell you that you are taking more than a couple of killer blows on every single round. It is best left for Janma, Sylvester, Enigmatic or even Raden who are at least his nemeses.
Spectator or whoever they are I am not bothered but then you have your opinion but not necessary everyone needs to behaves like you two cowards and traitors. (You two would later be trying to asked what do I mean, right. But then please look yourselves in the mirror and you will have the answer simply by reflecting on the comments you guys posted)
Rob tried to tell you that and you called him an anti-chinese bule.
LOL with this guy who is standing (not walking) on a tightrope. Does he display with much ambiguity?
PN is another Javanese but that doesn’t mean I agree with him totally what was said.
This is what you claimed but to others it is not what others interpret. I see it differently because the “two” of you are simply one of a same making.
However you are an arrogant Cheenaman who by your own account had made millions with Javanese connections and is now bad mouthing us.
When you said others to have lacked the english you guy had, I felt the arrogance is coming from the other side. But let me repeat this one more time so that you can shaft that up your arse. I may have made my millions but definitely not from the Javanese connections. That is a big NO. Working with them in Indonesia does not mean I need their connection to make my money. You Dig.
When I said that your responses lacked punch, it meant that there were many missed opportunities to counter PN’s onslaught. Instead you resorted to un-lawyerlike childish insults typical of uneducated peasant.
Why should I? You are referring to opportunities like asking you or him to kiss my arse? Pea Brain.
Your responses were non sequitur chinese whispered dungs. Instead of defending the Chinese, you are backing up PN’s claim of a stereotypical parasitic Cheeman.
When you read a sentence then read it as a whole, not just part of it. And I would definitely say the two of you are not only more than just stereotype parasites lynching on society but more like traitors to your country who constantly trying to draw the attention of others on how religious you are. The words used like ‘Cheeman’ I suppose you were referring to “cheenaman” and did you recall who used that? It is the only two of you. So did you expose yourselves as one of a kind?
I sometimes wonder you may be a straw puppet he created to beat the hell out of Cheeman.
Try a bit of consolation to yourself perhaps.
I recalled a live debate incident I witnessed in Taiwan many years ago. 2 rival candidates were debating on some issue. When one was losing ground; instead of accepting defeat, she spat at the face of her opponent incessantly, grabbed hold of the microphone and declared herself the winner of the debate. You reminded of her.
We have seen much of those typical Taiwanese debates without you bringing up. In this instance what you said is correct. But it only reflect to the two of you. Not me or anyone else.
Remember when he wrote” Its a lair” “There is not genocide” “There is no rape” This is quite similar to what you were trying to tell us that when he can’t win the debate he just needs to do that to win his “arguments”.
When the two of you can’t come up with a direct answer to a question, both of you tends to stay away for a while and beginning to think hard on how to counter that. Then you guys come back with “lubberly chicken” and your unfamiliar imitation of “haiya you lon like mai chicken” kind of stuffs.
With those you guys then try to put someone in between to cushion off.
So the two of you stop pretending
1. To be smart
2. To be religious
3. To impersonateWhen the two of you had made so much posting of anti Chinese and racist remarks here in the IM blog, stop pretending to be nice to others. Because you are what you are and nothing will change that. It is we find the urge to kick the arse of the two of you.
No wonder you guys made to the top of Chinese hater? Dare the two of you admit that?
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Dragonwall…
Is this directed at me? And, if it is I am not sure that I get what you mean?
LOL with this guy who is standing (not walking) on a tightrope. Does he display with much ambiguity?
Thanks.
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Rob…
I am making referrence on the ambiguity part of what he said not directed at you. Were there any ambiguity?But to consider, have you thought of yourself standing (not walking) on a tightrope.?
Thanks
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Nope on the tightrope, even if the point is about balance. Sometimes, one has to take a side, whether it be based on our principles, right or wrong, or on something else.
Taking a stand will always bring our balance into question. Sometimes the big questions in life are not about balance but rather about right and wrong.
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Enigmatic
Yeah, it’s beginning to be kinda boring with bigots like them, I guess so. And as to
I can see who’s the better one at arguments. There’s a bigot, ok maybe more, but that’s ok. don’t try to outtalk, sorry, outtype them, because it’s a waste of time.
I know. To me I am the least bothered about argumentation with these two guys because they, usually talk nonsense with their despecable detestation of Chinese. They even began to irritate people like Achmad and it is about time to tell them to f*ck off.
And that is
perhaps, this would better sum up what i have to say to you.
ren yi shi feng ping lang jing, tui yi bu hai kuo tian kong.Don’t you felt agitated? with your “ren yi shi feng ping lang jing”?
You are right to have taken this choice by saying
i can’t be bothered to read the rantings of certain people in this forum. not because i’m evading it. but because, really, it’s better doing some other consturctive work instead of coming up with counterarguments.
There is nothing to argue, except people like them felt compel to be outspoken with their ill conceive mind with all sorts of putdowns on the Chinese while admitting that the Chinese are way above what they considered themselves to be.
If you observe carefully, these people are actually admiring the Chinese but the envy in them just began to boil into jealousy that they want to show others that the Chinese are inferior, stealing, robbing, corrupt etc…etc..
Don’t you think it is about time?
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As to
even if the point is about balance.
Ever thought of over balance?
Sometimes, one has to take a side, whether it be based on our principles,
Even if that is in the direction of racial hatred? And
right or wrong, or on something else.
Anything ambiguious then?
Right! But
Taking a stand will always bring our balance into question. Sometimes the big questions in life are not about balance but rather about right and wrong
So how many times have you observe that his comments were made from? Right or Wrong?
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DW…
Over balance or under balance, same thing as not being in balance, right? Hence my point, that when one takes a stand, let’s say, on principle then balance might be lost in favour of the principle which can be argued as being one of right or wrong.
You are trying to twist my words to make it out that I am in favour of racial hatred or in favour of PN. To the contrary, I think we have an obligation to take a stand against racial hatred. PN (so is AAB) is a serial baiter and he is not real. In many ways perhaps Enigmatic is right in that I generally have better things to do than debate with a brick the merits of the substance of their arguments. I will not convince them and they will not convince me.
My point with respect to you is that telling someone to f*ck off or that they are a f*cking idiot is like a red rag to a bull and it is unlikely to win the argument. The analogy would be like the kid who brings the ball for a game of pick up basketball and then is the last one picked. So, he picks up his ball and tells one and all, “f*ck you”, and goes home.
I am not arguing that PN is beating you because his arguments are right. Once again, to the contrary, I am arguing that he is beating you because he is offering up piss weak secondary and tertiary sources such as Wikipedia and you are offering up anecdotal responses from personal experience. I am also suggesting that he is beating up on you because he is doing better at pushing your buttons and getting you to swear at him. Rather than seek to undermine the validity of the substance of his arguments you revert to calling him a f*ck wit.
Anyways, when it is all said and done, how you deal with PN, AAB, and any others you have issues with is up to you.
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I can agree that amidst a discussion sometimes balance are lost. One thing I think we all miss the point what we intend to elaborate.
I am not twisting words by saying you are a racist. When I commented I tend not to stray into another subject but into the Q & A.
We all knew that they are serial baiter trying to instigate, agitate, irritate and becoming a nuisance to the general public. But by no means they are pushing the button for me to swear at them.
I took words from Achmad who told them off for one so that they are aware that not only me who is not in favor of their stereotypical parasitic comments seeking to undermine others.
However nice they write in their comments will not get me simmered will not make them a better person. And I would say it is not about issues that matter by the topic at large.
I am well aware that they are trying to piss me off with all sorts of Chinese slurs and defamation. Just look into Citizenship Law and you will understand what I mean.
You are right when you say
I think we have an obligation to take a stand against racial hatred
Anyway thanks for your comments.
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Don’t you felt agitated? with your “ren yi shi feng ping lang jing”?
Of course dragonwall, which is why I’d rather they make themselves look stupider and expose themselves even more with their own posts. Because as they post more and more and become subject of ridicule, I can always look on the screen and just laugh away at them. Actually so can all of us.
I’m still seeing. Learning. Looking at how these people think. As I type this I’m formulating some topic for my History Research Paper for my Cambridge Exams here in Singapore. And chances are, it’s gonna be a topic about the relationship between Indonesia and her Chinese minority. I’m not that mature yet. I’m just 18.
But at the end of the day, do note that these bigots can only do that much to you. Why get agitated over what they write? Indeed on this forum they can put down the Chinese like us all they want, but chances are, in real life, they’ll have to deal with us in one way or another, perhaps as colleagues, perhaps even as subordinates. In the case of the latter, there is of course some cold comfort in knowing that while they can claim to have the upper ground here, with all the moral high ground they CLAIM to have over us etc, they can’t say so in the REAL world, where it matters most.
And just ignore them about the Singlish part. I study here, but I don’t use them on this forum. Only in my conversation with closer friends. And even then, Singlish is used sparingly. We know better who has better standards of English, do we not?
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And Dragonwall,
I’m sure we know better who the racists are don’t we?
Personally, I am against any form of racial hatred, anywhere. Not in Indonesia, not in Singapore, not anywhere. And I’ll take a quote from Rob to sum up my point.Anyways, when it is all said and done, how you deal with PN, AAB, and any others you have issues with is up to you.
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Enigmatic
You are right, I hope you do well in your exam. Perhaps one day you might be going to Singapore U or Open U and to prove to these racists that they are in no way any better by being a racist except to accept what is right and atone to their misfortune.
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DW,
Thanks man. I’ll probably be asking for help on this forum for recommendation on books for reference though. Maybe by next January.
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@ Dragonball
The issue here is your attitude. The other is your braindead cells, your inability to think laterally. No, you do not need perfect English to be a good debater, a healthy functioning brain works just fine but which is absent from you.
You said that your chemical factory was burned down during the anti-chinese riot. A few of my Chinese friends had their factories barricaded and protected by their pri workers. I wonder why none of them protected your property.
Enigmatic, I understand you have to stand by your own species, but this sewage eel is not worth your sympathy. You should dig out his first few exchanges with me and work out who is the problem. He has serious issue with pribumis. My 14 other siblings and I were brought up by our Singaporean aunty (head matron), I would be the last pri in Indonesia to have anti-chinese inclination. 5 of my younger siblings were private-tutored in Chinese by her. I myself speak fluently in several chinese dialects. Pu yun ker lian gher ker lao bern dan(mandarin)
My Singaporean auntie (my parents’ head matron) has this to say to him:Lau kiang kong bay chai phai say. Su mai jing su. Boh lunk cheow. Kor kau kang(hokkien)
My Indon Chinese friend had this for him:phu nia boh(teochew)
I have this to say to him: Diu ley lor moh chow hai(cantonese). -
When someone has an attitude problem they tend to say others have an attitude problem. Understandable it’s pathetic but anyway how regretable.
The number of postings you had on the IM Blogs clearly showed the way words and referrence are being written had displayed the devil in both of you with your ill conceive mind that were full of detestation and discrimination and now the denial by bringing up how you were helped by the Chinese, how you and your siblings were brought up by the Chinese and how you learn Chinese and that you had the intention to grab the Chinese and say, no no no I did not discriminate you, that you are not a racist, you liked the Chinese so much. But how many times have you made referrence by saying things like “Cheenaman” and so forth!
This shows that in referring to yourself whose braindead cells, your inability to think laterally shows an early signs of amnesia.
Haven’t you forgotten that I always told you and your good friend to “Ngaca Dulu” and that both of you did not know the meaning of “Minum Air Tidak Tahu Sumbernya?”
And by saying
No, you do not need perfect English to be a good debater, a healthy functioning brain works just fine but which is absent from you.
Wasn’t that you and your good ole buddy the ones to always whining an sighing?
You said that your chemical factory was burned down during the anti-chinese riot.
Then where were they located? Where is mine located? Right you were trying to like what Rob said a “serial baiter” trying to let me disclose where my factory is located so that you can come visit me? Ha.ha.ha.ha….
Oh, right! I suppose they did. Did anyone deny you this claim of yours?
A few of my Chinese friends had their factories barricaded and protected by their pri workers.
and
I wonder why none of them protected your property.
Yes my workers did at my office whch was in a different location from my factory. Even though, some of them also openly admitted that they participated in the looting during the riot.
Kelapa Gading was guarded, Taman Kencana paid a high price to have that protected, PIK was not! Part of Citra Garden was not!
As to
Enigmatic, I understand you have to stand by your own species, but this sewage eel is not worth your sympathy. You should dig out his first few exchanges with me and work out who is the problem. He has serious issue with pribumis.
So now you think that I need other’s sympathy? How mediocritic of you. It is not the few exchanges with you regarding my problems with pris but it is the problem of you and your buddy friend who has the big problem with the Chinese. I am sure, like what you said, not all reader in IM blogs are stupid! They could easily expose you.
As to
My 14 other siblings and I were brought up by our Singaporean aunty (head matron), I would be the last pri in Indonesia to have anti-chinese inclination. 5 of my younger siblings were private-tutored in Chinese by her. I myself speak fluently in several chinese dialects. Pu yun ker lian gher ker lao bern dan(mandarin)
So now you were trying to be nice to the Singaporean and the Chinese by saying that and speak fluently in several dialects? Like “Pu yun ker lian gher ker lao bern dan” is that correct? Can you write that out in Chinese for all to see so that we know your mastery in Chinese has been exceptional? Then I will show you what is Chinese writing.
Ah..You have a Singaporean auntie? Ha. “My Singaporean auntie (my parents’ head matron)” and you said he/she had this to say to me, like “Lau kiang kong bay chai phai say. Su mai jing su. Boh lunk cheow. Kor kau kang(hokkien)”
Is that hokkien? Well I think you or them or both showed with such prominence that your healthy mind is not working at all. You may be excusable if that is what you say but for your auntie a “Hokkien?” to say this, well I do think there is an Indonesian saying – “Jeruk yang buruk saling menular”and even “Your ‘Indon Chinese friend’ had this for me:phu nia boh(teochew)” You have Chinese friend? News to me! Then if that word is for me then he is also referring to you also right?
and “you have this to say to me: Diu ley lor moh chow hai(cantonese).”Peci, peci”
With all these: I sum you up by saying, if these is what you learn in life with all these profanity, swearing and cursing is simply amazing which is contrary to what you and you buddy friend always said that I frequent foul mouth and swear at others.
Hmm.. I suppose this is one of the way you camourflage the evil in you at the same time also trying to display your proficiency in Chinese language by saying.
Su mai jing su. Boh lunk cheow. Kor kau kang
phu nia boh
Diu ley lor moh chow haiDiu…..mou lan yong…
So which connection you have that is connected to your Chinese friends?
What your buddy friend said like ‘ DOGS LIKE YOU BORN IN A BARN DON’T MAKE A HORSE” I have to agree that I am beginning to learn more of such putdowns and insults.
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Now let me expose the profanities, the swearing and cursing that you had championed.
1.Pu yun ker lian gher ker lao bern dan(mandarin)
You were trying to get the pinyin of “?????????”in Mandarin meaning don’t sympahtize with this old guy, but your pinyin needs polishing let alone the chinese.
2.
Lau kiang kong bay chai phai say.
You were trying to say “???????”in Hokian meaning A con saying without shame and again your pinyin is out of this world.
3.
Su mai jing su
This is “????”in Hokian Dialect or Mandarin Not admitting defeat still show sign what you hear means your ears need digging.
4.
. Boh lunk cheow. Kor kau kang(hokkien)
Which is “???”“???”in Hokian Dialect written in Mandarinmeaning No Dick, f*ck By A Dog.
5.
My Indon Chinese friend had this for him:phu nia boh(teochew)
Your Indon Friend said to you “????”in Teochew Dialect written in Mandarin F*ck Your Mother. Good.
and lastly6.
I have this to say to you: Diu ley lor moh chow hai(cantonese).
Which is “??????”in Cantonese Dialect written in Mandarin meaning “F*ck Your Mother’s Dirty Kant”
Now let us all in the IM blog try understand what sh*t is this guy trying to display!
His proficiency in various Dialects, or Mandarin or Profanity. And what does that prove? Is he a munafik?
Comment on “What is Racism?”.
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Dragonwall:
since you offered me such interesting material on Tansil:
why not read all about your CHinese friends and illegal immigration racketeering- by Salim:
Hokkien Chinese- will they ever learn to abide by the law?