Argument Topics
Sep 1st, 2008, in Asides, by PatungThe next funny installment of Purba vs various people, Achmad’s Oigal obsession, East Timor, Batam, plenty of other stuff…cut from Dating Girls thread.
133 Comments on “Argument Topics”
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Achmad…
On the common knowledge angle of Australian soldiers taking war trophies in Vietnam. You need to link this one so that we can all have the common knowledge that you have. While your at it you might also want to check out whether Indonesians ever engaged in the taking of trophies in Timor Leste or Aceh.
AAB…
When are you going to start advancing some arguments again rather than insults? You really seem to be living off the back of Achmad. Perhaps you are the same fella or live in the same boarding house?
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Andy says:
Funny Purba I didn’t mention your name so why get involved? Is it that you know your own countrymen can’t stand on their own two feet without a little back up like all the other gutless …s I met over there. Can’t fight or argue one on one with bules can you. Pathetic race.
No I could more than cut it there but grew tired of the small, shallow racist people who call themselves pribumi Indonesians.
As for my wife, she is reading this with me and laughing at you too. She knows all too well what racist bigoted people you are and how it is your people who can’t ‘cut the mustard’ with either chinese or bules. She was ridiculed as ‘cina, cina’ during her schooldays. She is glad to be in a more refined, mature country like mine away from corrupt lowlifes like yourself.
PN-margainally educated common Ostrayan
On the subject of education, can you please spell margainally for all of us? correctly? -
Aluang Anak Bayang says:
@ Rob
Beside the common peci and the well-trimed hedge, both which in Indonesia symbolises life-time accomplishment, maturity and wisdom, we are both different person. However as Javanese, descendants of the priviledged and aristrocratic Mojopahitan bloodline, we value friendship with Bules on equal footing. We rather defeat Bule in the intellectual arena rather than in battle field like the Middle Eastern where unneccessary lives are lost.
@ Andy
I could be wrong about whores episode. Maybe you could explain a little more to Mets and Farah. Please no insult as it is a biatch to be a moderator. Ask Patung.
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Achmad Sudarsono says:
Rob,
Click around, Big Fella, you’ll find it. Or ask Oigsie (Oigster, Oigarama, the Big Oig, Ogre, Ogle), he’ll have heard of such goings on.
Oigster, you still haven’t told us what you were doing in East Timor back in the ’90s.
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Achmad…
What? I have to do my own research? I thought I could just come to IM and pose my question and demand a link and you would facilitate the information for me!
Oh well, click around it will have to be then!
Enjoy your day!
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Oigal says:
you still haven’t told us what you were doing in East Timor back in the ’90s.
Way too broad a time zone sport..but perhaps scuba diving, perhaps attending university in the region..perhaps working with UN, perhaps working with the Oz Military..perhap all of the above perhaps none..
Tell us Assmad ever been there?
BTW…It’s not East Timor anymore..rememberAndy..you really shouldn’t let these wankers sucker you too much..they are no more Indonesian than you are… sad little white silver spooners, who have done nothing in their lives and unlikely ever will.
You have seen them around, the sad, pasty little low-mid level office johnnies counting or spending money that other people have earned. Managed to pick up a bit of bahasa on the tax payers dollar and like most of their type think they understand it all works..when the biggest personal challenge they have every faced is when one the one time personal courage was called for and they were measured and found wanting..
Treat them as a mild diversion, but certainly don’t insult Indonesians by assuming they represent anything but pimples on the arse of humanity..
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DXP says:
a simple question to PN, being as a TNI retiree, is it possible using his pay cheques saving to sent his son/doughter for overseas univ education ? unless it unlawfully earned money?
so what makes a corrupt TNI retiree be a better patriotic pribumi man than his chinese brothers who run brothels unlawfully in Batam ? I see the same ‘haram’ money, the difference is, the sexually addicted men who paid the brothel’s workers in Batam could likely were happy & satisfied clients with the services performed (so the payees were happy then the money become ‘halal’ so to speak) but the ill gotten money from corruption are less likely be gotten from happy businessmen who paid the extra cost of doing business (so the money become ‘haram’) -
anyway , DXP learnt from Indonesian culture : ‘salamat aidil fitri – baik2 nak ibadah puase, maaf lahir batin’ … I am sorry – tue pu jie
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@ DXP
What is wrong with a pribumi who make it rich in his own land?
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Oigs,
The Timor Leste government invited me on a Ukuele and Dangdut tour where I played to sold-out audiences. Ah the old taxpayer dollar, wait hang-on, doesn’t that include the Oz military. And gee, Oigal, I think the most taxing thing most Australian officers have ever done is move papers from one side of the desk to the other.
The most courage called for was deciding to file for compo after spraining the ankle getting out of the golf cart. No, for Indonesia the danger of the Australian military is not that they’ve done too much, but too little. They’re a bunch of whingers taking showers in raincoats.
I love how you think because we write well we’re not Indonesian.
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Oigal,
P.S. I wonder if the military ever wastes money…
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Purba Negoro says:
No.
My son is sent overseas on my money earnt via business. This business is money earnt legitmately post- military service.
I only wish I could land good military or government contract- but there are many bigger fish above me- you must take note.
If I lived soley on pensiun- I would be eating worse than a vagabond on my dreadful TNI remittance.
It is less than Rp 3 million per month- not even enough for maids salary.
The military hospital is too far too- I prefer RS Pondok Indah- they have nicer food and good doctors.I know very well former minister of Trade- he is a board chairholder in a large plastics company now. Only served one Suharto cabinet.
The moral is- even he too has to work – the rat race does not stop even for him.
I also know former head of Police for Jakarta quite well. He is suffering financially too.We medium to big fish are nowhere near the same league- not even the same species.
Do not believe all you read- there are middle fish, big fish and then there are the whales- just like in China.I very much doubt Mr Hu Jintao will retire a pauper, Mr DXP.
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Sting a bit sad one did it…ho di ho
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Not really Oigal,
You’ve just squirmed and wormed and dodged.
You haven’t said what you think of the trials of the S.A.S soldier, or what others thought at the time.
You haven’t commented on the 2 decades of pen-pushing and paper shuffling in the Australian military. The reality is the most action most of you guys has seen is the photocopying machine breaking down.
Nor have you said anything about the various compo scams pulled by former soldiers for non-existent ailments.
Overall, this pious, holier-than-though attitude, “I know what the real world is like,” is just hot air. No one wastes more taxpayer’s money than the military. Look at the trailer parks in Iraq.
You did learn one thing, perhaps from Sun Tzu: evade the enemy, like you’ve evaded this debate.
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Yawn or Laugh..decisions, decisions..The SAS soldier…didn’t I read here they were all Gurkas …laugh..what case?..Trailer Parks?? Are we still on the the SAS or Tim Tim…The SAS have tralier parks? Compo…
Ok let me see if I have the main thrust of your and your fellow pasty rent boys discussion points. “The Australian Gurka SAS Regiment are all on Compo in Iraq whilst running a trailer park for broken photocopy machines meanwhile 500,000 illiterate fishermen in thongs are invading darwin and marching on Sydney via the red centre”
I apologise if I missed any of your more salient points in the above summary but preety sure the pretty much the basics.
As an aside, you really should seek treatment for that ADD sport.
I did find the Photo copy comment amusing, this being your weapon of choice n all..sheesh..just look at your comments..over and over and over and over…zzzzzzzzzz
Come on Assmad..that’s it get back to counting other people’s money now, there is a limit to how much time we can spend teasing the pasty office johnies
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Oigs,
As I said, squirm, wriggle, evade.
* Gurkha, Schmirka, so what, working for the Australians or not ?
You still haven’t said what you think and how officers see such abuses in their own military.
* Alot of fortified trailer parks in Iraq. Alot of wastage.
* Australian army didn’t do much but shuffle papers between the end of Vietnam & the 1999 East Timor intervention.
Most officers were desk-bound bureaucrats, ergo, your whole, “had-working-honest-soldier-schtick,” who’s seen the “real world,” is a bit thick, my friend.
Few agencies waste more tax payer money than the Australian military. You know it. I know it.
Kopassus should be training your army — they’ve seen more action !
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Mets says:
@ Oigal – question, are you telling me you have never come across an Indonesian that can speak & write fluent english…just curious, as I know when I fill out the application forms under ethnicity in London – I would find it a real push to tick the british white, or white other box lo!!!
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still haven’t said what you think and how officers see such abuses in their own military.
What abuses dimwit..in fact if anything the ADF goes way way overboard with caring an sharing..
Australian army didn’t do much but shuffle papers between the end of Vietnam & the 1999 East Timor intervention.
Your everyday ignorance is a miracle of nature…od you really need me to make list for you (I concur fairly sure there was no WW3 in that period unless you happened to be timorese,,or papaun or….)
Few agencies waste more tax payer money than the Australian military. You know it. I know it.
Spoken like a true closeted and protected, sliver spooned twit..what agency employs you for instance?
Kopassus should be training your army — they’ve seen more action !
Oh back on the Papuan and Tim Tim villagers thing are we..sheesh..you do so squirm
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Oigs
It’s ok if you don’t want to talk about it, Oigal.
But do drop the wounded soldier thing.
For anyone else, story below.
http://www.abc.net.au/am/stories/s692071.htm
SAS war crime allegations
PRINT FRIENDLY EMAIL STORY
AM – Thursday, 3 October , 2002 00:00:00
Reporter: Rafael Epstein
LINDA MOTTRAM: United Nations investigators in East Timor have dug up the bodies of two militiamen, to help an Australian Army inquiry into allegations of torture and brutality by SAS troops.The most serious allegation is that one militiaman was shot in the head with a handgun, a possible execution.
The men died in the first gun battle involving Australia’s elite SAS troops in Timor in 1999.
The army’s already facing trouble over that incident. Earlier this year, an SAS soldier who’d been injured in East Timor and was later dismissed, claimed that he’d been mistreated and told that “the SAS is not a holding tank for busted soldiers.”
Rafael Epstein reports.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN: At dusk on October 6 in 1999 an SAS jeep was ambushed on a road near Suai on the western border of East Timor. It came just hours after a short gun battle nearby between INTERFET troops and Timorese militia at a roadblock.
PETER COSGROVE: This was the first time that INTERFET soldiers have directly engaged armed militia.
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Oh Come on METS, Stop being so sensitive, please read the comments in context of the flatulent frauds we are talking with. It has nothing to do with race or my opinions or otherwise on Indonesians as a whole. Are you seriously thinking that Assmad and his dodgy mate are Indonesians??
Secondly don’t for a moment think that interactions/discussions with the said dodgies should be applied with commonsense or rational behaviour anywhere else or to anyone else.
Although if you claiming ASSMAD as yours..please do..But no absolutely no Refunds and I do recommend spaying at the earliest opportunity (although that may have already been done).
Assmad, ..Despite your obvious baiting, unlike yourself, I find it pretty difficult to talk about something to the best of my knowledge I never saw or heard about from any relaible source. As much as you may try and bait, a culture of abuse or torture does not exist in the Oz Military nor most other militaries/ police forces where human rights and civilian control of the Military exists and even the odd nutcase rogue will sooner or later to be held to account.
I notice you report was dated 2002, I assume its was proven false as I don’t recall any particular case (oh, of course, it was a conspiracy to cover it up, thats why the Oz Military called in the Un to help keep it secret).
You have obviously trawled far and wide and if this is the best you can do then I suggest you have strengthed my point rather than any you trying to make. It would be interesting to see what results you would pull with a simliar effort to uniformed thugs closer to home.
Why are human rights and dignity seem to such a play thing for you..Are you that far removed from reality that it really doesn’t matter to you at all?. I can understand it from some..but you – despite your inane comments and disregard for others, you obviously have the educational back ground and yet…sad really.. Just proves that education does not change what the person is inside.
“the SAS is not a holding tank for busted soldiers.” Not sure what your point is here (why would that surprise me?), even in the Australian Gurka SAS (lol) it would be a factual statement. Not much point having an SAS of busted soldiers.
If you are implying that the OZ government treats its vets badly, I fully concur!
Wounded Soldier…I am sorry I never said or implied that.. but that’s difference between you and me..even when provoking you or even when I am plain wrong (it happens..last tuesday i thought it would rain for instance) I don’t deliberately lie by omission or fact. You on the other hand, could not lie straight in bed.
thanks for coming..now about that door on the way out
Thanks Anyway
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Oigsy-Poigsy,
As mentioned, if you don’t want to talk about it, it’s ok.
Despite your obvious baiting, unlike yourself, I find it pretty difficult to talk about something to the best of my knowledge I never saw or heard about from any relaible source.
“the SAS is not a holding tank for busted soldiers.”
They said it, not me.
Finally, we’ve talked about the Indonesian military ad infinitum ad nauseum. Now it’s the Aussie’s turn.
All I wanna do is Tell It Like It Is.
My education was in the Pesantren.
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@ Oigal – I did – still not getting your point sorry !!! as eloquent as you are please don’t take it the wrong way ….your responses are full of words with more than 3 syllables it reminds of me of how my performance manager writes his reports to the board…when he asks me to authorise, I throw out the window and I now have sent him to go on a plain english report writing course lol!!
Simple girl I am!!
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METS..
Fair enough,let me make try some plain english (mm..interesting never been accused of being overly eloquent before..wonders will never cease).
I have met any number of Indonesians who speak and write better English than Assmad and his dodgy mates. They have proven time and again they have more in common with the idle, pasty, bule office johnnies that infest a number of Asian Capitials than any Indonesian. This based on sad substance of their discussion points rather than their mastery of the language. I admit I do rise to their baiting when I have the time but generally its the return of serve ..rubbish begets rubbish.
Further on English skills re nationality. In fact, a good friend of ours (local schoolteacher) regularly brings me down to earth with what I don’t don’t about the English langauge and its construct (as a partial defence, I did have leave school rather early and work, contrary to popular belief in Indonesia not all australians are born rich and idle ..assmad not included). So my writing skills poor as they are a self (and badly) taught.
However, the offer still stands, if you truely wish to claim ownership of the said sad ones..please do. It could almost be called a community aid project.
Last Point on Plain English… I understand your comment trouble is when speaking to people like Assmad…To break the discussion down to its most needed and simple form, every reply would have to be..
YOU WANKER..which whilst accurate in his case, not very exciting
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Hear, hear to Mets,
Oigsie.
Coincidentally, I offered a few tips in another post.
In general, try to keep sentences short.
Try not to use complicated words where simple ones will do.
Try not to use foreign words where English ones will do. (You don’t have to worry about the early 20th century fashion of preferring Anglo-Saxon to Latin words).
Finally, it’s ok to break any of the above rules rather than break the rythym of a sentence.
Put in the big ones, Oigal !
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Oh and Mets
As a Manager myself (sssh Assmad adults are talking) I found this comment interesting
how my performance manager writes his reports to the board…when he asks me to authorise, I throw out the window
Is his report wrong in context or content or you just didn’t like his/her style of writing?
I would imagine its very disheartening for someone to work hard on something ask for it to be authorised and then just have it disregarded. I was very lucky in my early career that I had a boss who advised me to correct subordinates factual errors but not the tone/style of their writing unless absolutely necessary or one of two things will happen. 1. They will stop/avoid writing or reporting (and thereby developing) 2. They will write in the way they think you want them, thereby stilting their own persective and opinions (so you might as well write it yourself anyway)
As he advised me at the time, be careful you are massaging their writing skills and not your own ego..
Of course that just my experience as a simple guy. Mind you it still happens from time to time. However the first time I find someone has re-written a report of mine, then that is the last time they receive information from me and I make it my business to formally comment on each and every report they make from then on (but then I have a vindicative streak..a character flaw if you will).
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@ Oigal – Point taken and no it is not to massage my ego…. the officer in question had a very bad habit of not being able to put his point across to his audience (executive board level),therefore its context, the most annoying thing he has the right skill sets & knowledge base, if he is to carry on in this manner he will never progress – as I am very clear that his goal to eventually become a Head of Service in my division – I have no problem with this & I also consider it a failing on my part as a manager, if any of my staff do not progress from their current role within 5 years….
Whilst I will provide every opportunity for each manager/ officer in my division to access training & courses to increase their personal development,but, if I feel their performance is impacting on the overall division/ service area – I will kick them out !!!
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Aww METS you are just making feel bad now..Actually it was a bit of a zinger post just trying to demonstrate to our dodgy mates that you can zing someone with resorting to ever more boring racist and oh so predicable stero typing.
Whilst I will provide every opportunity for each manager/ officer in my division to access training & courses to increase their personal development,but, if I feel their performance is impacting on the overall division/ service area – I will kick them out
As it should be..good luck
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Is just me or is ANDY and ASSMAD the same person?
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don’t insult me please oigal
Comment on “Argument Topics”.
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No Andy-
the world laughs at the puffed up self-important jingoisitic British outposts of Singapore and Australia.
Countries so tritley derivative, they must invent a history and culture.
Of course, the minoiry of Singaporeans and Australians are very pleasant, cultured people.
I’m referring to the margainally educated common Ostrayan and their love of the vulgar you personify, Andy.
We’re all now well aware of how such a loser in his own country couldn’t cut the mustard here, so go put some more shrimps on your barbecue to take your mind off how your wife would have a far nicer life here, despite all thge obvious problems, than in your beloved Le Grande Alcatraz: Australia.
And spare us all your famous Ostrayan export: cheap whine.