Feminism and Islam
May 22nd, 2007, in Society, by PatungFeminism is not suitable for Indonesian women.
Eny Dwiningsih, a professor at the Islam State University in Jakarta (UIJ), said in a seminar called “Developing Intellectual Interest in Womens’ Issues” at the North Sumatra University in Medan on 18th May that Islam rejected feminism.
Feminism was dangerous to Islam because it was infused with the spirit of secularism, opposed to sharia law, and based on false assumptions, she said.
The secularised capitalist nations of the world had for a long time been attempting to force feminism on Muslims, in the name of womens’ freedom, and they suggested that personal freedom generally was the answer to many problems, and that Islam was the source of the Islamic world’s backwardness.
Faithful Muslim women were confused today and had lost their self-confidence and belief in their special roles in the family and society, and this showed that the secular capitalists had partly succeeded in their mission: republika
This is the target of the movement, that is, to cause Muslims to lose faith in the ability of Islam to answer the problems that women face.
163 Comments on “Feminism and Islam”
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Ihaknt says:
Dimp I disagree that the Gov failed in trying to integrate. Integration is like a relationship. It takes two to make it work. The people themselves also need to ‘want’ to integrate (from both sides). If many of these people have been there long but refuse to integrate then government cant do anything about it. It’s not something you can force but can be worked together if both sides are willing to give it a go.
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Achmad Sudarsono says:
Ihaknt, My ‘Friend,’ they can be forced to integrate. One thing Australia could do is import the Pancasila. Of course they would change ‘Indonesia’ for ‘Australia.’ All citizens would be forced to study it and the power of the Garuda would make the immigrant integrate. Ok Friend?
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Julita says:
A. Sudarsono “Pancasila” do you mean it is working well in Indonesia?.
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Ibu Julita Yth,
It is working for the people whose hearts are open to it. I feel a surge of joy every time I see the gold-specked Garuda Pancasila sparkling in the sunlight, and indeed any time. I sense skepticism from you. I recommend you study in-depth, the butir-butir of the Pancasila and the right way will be clear, through feminism, Anti-Australianism, and everything we have been discussing on this Blog. It is true, yes, that there are many Indonesians who still need to open their hearts, but in the long run, Pancasila will endure.
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Come on everybody, Australians are like anybody else if not better. We have to really ‘ngaca dulu’ dong.
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Xmale says:
Mohammed Khafi Says:
Allah does not say that they are, he just tells us not to eat the flesh of pigs because it is contaminated.
1600 years ago pigs were full of disease, now with modern breeding techniques they are not contaminated. 1600 years ago Allah was right,now he is wrong? Just a small proof that all this religious nonsense is man made.
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Dimp says:
Hi ihaknt,
Dimp I disagree that the Gov failed in trying to integrate. Integration is like a relationship. It takes two to make it work. The people themselves also need to ‘want’ to integrate (from both sides). If many of these people have been there long but refuse to integrate then government cant do anything about it. It’s not something you can force but can be worked together if both sides are willing to give it a go.
Yes, it takes two to make it work, but the Australian government has never actually push for integration, they never push for the people to adapt for the surrounding, that is why some area like Tamworth actually rejected for more Sudanese refugees to be relocated there, because they don’t understand about the Sudanese. If the government has actively push for integration through better education of the Australian people then the people are more willing to integrate.
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Dimp
lets not play dumb. If the gov forces them then the gov will be labeled as racist. Serba salah toh? It takes two, just like the singing competition..it takes two baby…it takes two baby…me and you.
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Ihaknt,
Friend, why do you continue to ignore the most simple, yet brilliant solution for all social ills, the Pancasila ?
Friend, I think you could benefit from its healing powers, too. Although you mean well, you often display basic flaws in your reasoning that should have been cured in grade-school. I’m happy to help because you seem to be trying and seem like a nice person, if a bit slow on the uptake.
So once again: go back to the Butir2. Study them. Remember the words of Pak ‘Harto. Everything will be clear.
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Greg says:
Please Achmad,
people are getting tired of your ‘wisdom’/joke. Let’s be serious here.
If you think Pancasila is so great, maybe our government should file a patent for it, and then sell the license to other countries.“war? famine? financial difficulties? we have the solution for them all: PANCASILA.”
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Sudarsono:
It is working for the people whose hearts are open to it. I feel a surge of joy every time I see the gold-specked Garuda Pancasila sparkling in the sunlight, and indeed any time. It is true, yes, that there are many Indonesians who still need to open their hearts, but in the long run, Pancasila will endure.
Good for you, you feel a surge of joy to see the gold-specked Garuda Pancasila sparkling in the sunlight.
I put more pride and uphold the idealistic content of Pancasila, it is not enough just to open one’s heart to it. It needs commitment, effort from every individual to make sure it will prevail, no choice it is for all, otherwise it will result in misery for some. People should feel comfortable, peaceful, living together in unity under the wings of the ‘Garuda’ under Pancasila. Unity in diversity, diversity in race, culture, religion etc.etcThere is concern for one another, the poor will be taken care of, no riots against any other race, no burning/ransacking of churches/mosques/temples/houses, no lashing of people in public, no intruding into people’s houses and abusing it’s inhabitants, no forcing people to convert to any religion but can freely choose what is in their hearts. In this case, anti apostacy organizations, sorry to say, would become illegal. The guy who hit Moni would be put into jail.
Once people’s attention is more on education, economy, peace of mind then we hope prosperity will follow.
So a strong committed government body and a law which works would be a must.A. Sudarsono: I sense skepticism from you.
It sounds better coming from the ex-president which I fully agree:Meanwhile former president (2001-2004) Megawati Soekarnoputri said on two occasions recently, the first on 30th May in Surakarta or Solo, Central Java, the second on 1st June in Ende, Nusa Tenggara Timur (NTT), that the national ideology of Pancasila was increasingly being ignored.
A. Sudarsono: I recommend you study in-depth, the butir-butir of the Pancasila and the right way will be clear, through feminism, Anti-Australianism, and everything we have been discussing on this Blog.
Thanks for your thoughtfulness. The school I attended did a good job at it and in the following I will post for all, especially those who have never read it, to know how ideal it is.
The Five Principles
[edit] (1) Belief in the one and only God (Ketuhanan yang Maha Esa)
This principle reaffirms the Indonesian people’s belief that God does exist. It also implies that the Indonesian people believe in life after death. It emphasizes that the pursuit of sacred values will lead the people to a better life in the hereafter. The principle is embodied in the 1945 Constitution and reads: “The state shall be based on the belief in the one and only God”.
[edit] (2) Just and civilized humanity (Kemanusiaan yang Adil dan Beradab)
This principle requires that human beings be treated with due regard to their dignity as God’s creatures. It emphasizes that the Indonesian people do not tolerate physical or spiritual oppression of human beings by their own people or by any other nation.
[edit] (3) The unity of Indonesia (Persatuan Indonesia)
This principle embodies the concept of nationalism, of love for one’s nation and motherland. It envisages the need to always foster national unity and integrity. Pancasila nationalism demands that Indonesians avoid feelings of superiority on the grounds of ethnicity, for reasons of ancestry and skin color. In 1928 Indonesian youth pledged to have one country, one nation and one language, while the Indonesian coat of arms enshrines the symbol of “Bhinneka Tunggal Ika” which means “unity in diversity”.
[edit] (4) Democracy guided by the inner wisdom in the unanimity arising out of deliberations amongst representatives (Kerakyatan yang Dipimpin oleh Hikmat Kebijaksanaan dalam Permusyawaratan/Perwakilan)
Pancasila democracy calls for decision-making through deliberations, or musyawarah, to reach a consensus, or mufakat. It is democracy that lives up to the principles of Pancasila. This implies that democratic right must always be exercised with a deep sense of responsibility to God according to one’s own conviction and religious belief, with respect for humanitarian values of man’s dignity and integrity, and with a view to preserving and strengthening national unity and the pursuit of social justice.
[edit] 5) Social justice for the whole of the people of Indonesia (Keadilan Sosial bagi Seluruh Rakyat Indonesia)
This principle calls for the equitable spread of welfare to the entire population, not in a static but in a dynamic and progressive way. This means that all of the country’s natural resources and the national potentials should be utilized for the greatest possible good and happiness of the people. Social justice implies protection of the weak. But protection should not deny them work. On the contrary, they should work according to their abilities and fields of activity. Protection should prevent willful treatment by the strong and ensure the rule of justice.In regard to your suggestion that Australia should adopt the Pancasila. As far as I know, they are in a very good shape. They have a strong government and their law works, to me Australia is fine as it is.
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Mohammed Khafi says:
Apologies for going off topic again, but I would like to reply!
Xmale said:
1600 years ago pigs were full of disease, now with modern breeding techniques they are not contaminated. 1600 years ago Allah was right, now he is wrong? Just a small proof that all this religious nonsense is man made.
Thank you Xmale, you obviously have pathology lab reports to back up your claim that “1600 years ago pigs were full of disease” or are you talking from a position of complete ignorance?
Trichinosis is endemic in swine, either wild or farm reared, and cannot be eradicated by breeding programs, it is still a source of human illness even in the United States, where animal husbandry is to a much higher standard than in poorer less developed countries. This is why pork used in uncooked pork products such as salami’s and cured meats must be deep frozen to a specific temperature and for a specific period of time (to kill the parasite) before it is allowed to be used in these products.
God was right and remains right! And was right many years before 1600 years ago, as the prohibition on eating the flesh of Swine was from Torah (Pentateucht, part of the Old Testament), it was just repeated in Al Quran.
Whilst I agree with you that religious nonsense is manmade, you can only prove that from a position of knowledge, which you obviously don’t have.
Peace
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All My Friend,
I think we’ve strayed far, far from the topic here. Let us continue with our discussions of Pancasila, Indonesia’s greatness, and Greg’s lack of grammar in another posting.
Achmad.
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I am going to transfer my posting of June 11, 2007 at 10:33 to it’s respected heading, which is National Ideology.
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Hi ihaknt,
If the gov forces them then the gov will be labeled as racist.
Not by force, but through information and education, the Tamworth people obviously have no information on the Sudanese refugees and their culture, that is why some of them were pelted with eggs when they walked on the streets of Tamworth.
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But that’s the country dude…dimana mana orang desa are a bit closed minded. What a waste of eggs, but. That reminds me, I need to get some to bake a cake. Thanks Dimp.
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Hi ihaknt,
My point exactly, the gov’t should realise that the country should get more info and education, yet they just dumped those Sudanese refugees there.
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Thank you Xmale, you obviously have pathology lab reports to back up your claim that “1600 years ago pigs were full of disease” or are you talking from a position of complete ignorance?
You will find disease in any animal products if it is not prepared properly. A billion people a day consume pork products, I don’t see any falling over and dying.
Please note I will refrain from insulting you.
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Parvita says:
Hi Xmale, I think what it means in the Koran does not stop to ‘eating’ it literally. I would say ‘eating’ interpreted as consuming, adapting, putting into your body the behaviour of pigs. Pigs eat their own turd, screw each other even their mothers. I would more say that Islam teaches to not live shamelessly like pigs, or swine. If it is about food only, I would assume that based on disease, avian and cows would also be banned because the bird flu and mad cow disease, yet it is not written like that. IF that is the case, Koran should say so because Koran is universal and it applies for all time.
But again, we are speaking about faith. I guess being a vegetarian is a safe place!
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Cukurungan says:
Xmale,
The answer to your question given by Khafi that only represented a tinny minority of the exclusive group so called “sunnah rejector” and those answer didn’t represent the mainstream moslem beliefs like me. Our opinion toward God “perintah and larangan” is quite clear, When God forbid us to consump a pork meats that full stop no need be questioned, we shall consider the pork forbidden for us whatever it forms and the way it cooked. Because If the reasoning Khafi applied, it doesn’t make sense at all, there’s so many more dangerous the animal meat than the pork meat to human health why God only forbid us to eat “PORK” explicitely while God didn’t forbid us to eat “Scorpion, Tarantula, cat and snakes ” explicitely in Quran because God know “normal human” won’t consump those disgusting meats.
The religion for me us is trust something beyond the human sense because if it is only about the human sense we don’t need religion at all and any religion islam, Christian, Hindusm you just name it are full of the beyond sense.
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Parvita,
Friend,
I read the Koran today about the news.
I thank you, Friend.
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Cukurungan:
For me I don’t have any objection with Feminism as long as they don’t touch Man privilege given by God to have 4 halal wives.
Sorry, you are all losing ground. Feminism is alright though some are getting too far and that becomes wrong. Man privilige “given by God” to have 4 halal wives, where did you get that?
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Julita,
But it can work well. As A.A. Gym said, woman is ‘mono,’ but man is ‘stereo.’ Why in god’s holy name should I have to stick to just one ? In Iran they’ve taken this arrangement to a useful level. You can ‘marry’ a woman at certain establishments, consummate the marriage for half an hour or so, (in my case a golden 30 seconds!). Afterwards, you can summon the Penghulu and divorce the little filly’s ass ! Everything is halal. But if you weren’t allowed to have more than one wife, it wouldn’t work.
Thank, Friend.
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Sylvester says:
It happens in Iran? Are you sure? Unbelieveable!
With regards to AAGym, he just a hypocrite. Almost no one listen to him now. -
Didnt surprise me for a man like Ono to last only 30 seconds.
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Ihaknt,
That’s a bit of a below-the-belt, comment…ha ha ha. At least it was a ‘golden’ 30-seconds…
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I am leaving now for the week-end, will get back to you, be sure!!!!!!!!
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Still wondering whether I will waste my effort to discuss this matter with you or wait for another good opportunity when participants are knowledgable and talk sense. Sorry, no offence. It is just that I only talk sense.
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Ibu Julita,
Of course we only talk sense here. Friend, why does it make sense for me to have only one woman when I can have many in a halal way? God has given us these urges, but in his wisdom, ways to channel those urges. My Friend, as mentioned, Man needs many outlets. He is like a power plug that needs many different sockets to work. He can work on different continents. No transformer needed. Woman is different. She must be faithful.
What can make more sense than that, Friend?
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I think the fact that the leader of the country (J-Ho) is George Bush’s lap-dog doesn’t really help the cause for Australia to be respectable in the international community. J-Ho is still playing “George (Simon) Says” and seems to be very good at it.
It is a bit hard for an isolated country like Australia to do business with the Asian neighbours when they don’t ‘play nice’.